Talk:Kim Jong Il

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Yuri Kim (ambassador) which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 06:06, 25 May 2022 (UTC)

A Kim here, a Kim there, and before long you're talking some real Kim

Does anyone see the inherent difficulty in colloquially referring to the subject as "Kim" when the article necessarily deals with two other principals who share the family name "Kim"? rowley (talk) 02:52, 30 May 2022 (UTC)

Kim by surname only should exclusively refer to Kim Jong-il, who is the subject of this article. If there are specific instances that's ambiguous, use the full name. This should be the case with any other bio article, and I don't think such edits would be deemed controversial so it should be free of edit wars, in theory. --Nidaana (talk) 14:36, 25 July 2022 (UTC)

Edit request

Юрий Ким (Russian: Yuri Kim; the recorded birth name in the article) redirects here. Please add a hatnote to handle the situation.

{{redirect|Юрий Ким|other people|Yuri Kim (disambiguation)}}

"Юрий Ким" redirects here. For other people, see Yuri Kim (disambiguation).

-- 64.229.88.43 (talk) 21:21, 7 June 2022 (UTC)

 Not done: This is English Wikipedia not Russian Wikipedia, a redirect of Russian title to the English title is not a valid reason for such inclusion. — Paper9oll (🔔 • 📝) 13:30, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

Typo Fix

In the section Ascension to Power, subheading Initial Career, the last sentence of the second paragraph has a typo. "...indicating that Kim Il-sung bight have already planned for Jong-il to succeed him as leader." Alberto996 (talk) 21:21, 31 July 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 October 2022

2001:F40:907:93AA:C980:8482:9F7B:8B0F (talk) 10:29, 11 October 2022 (UTC)

Birth date

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Terasail^[✉️] 10:38, 11 October 2022 (UTC)

Eternal General Secretary vs. Eternal Chairman

Method	Eternal General Secretary	Eternal Chairman
Google search	9,000	4,270
Google Books	453	221
Google Scholar	79	25

@TaerkastUA: What settings are you using for your "cursory Google searches"? Mine return greater results for Eternal General Secretary each time. Even if you search the exact phrases "Eternal General Secretary Kim" and "Eternal Chairman Kim", you still get greater results for the former. Ngrams produce nothing for Eternal Chairman [Kim].

Eternal General Secretary is the more common posthumous title for Kim Jong-il because the General Secretary of the WPK was a more prominent position than the Chairman of the NDC. Eternal Chairman has always been a secondary title, like how Chairman of the NDC was a secondary title for Kim Jong-il during his lifetime.

It's also worth noting that Google Search (i.e. just the general search engine) is a terrible measure because it includes self-published material (including social media), which often copies sites like Wikipedia without much thought. "Generalissimo Kim Jong-il" for example returns a significant number of results, but no reliable secondary sources use "Generalissimo" in this manner, nor do any official English sources from the DPRK. An editor on the English Wikipedia made the translation themselves and nobody questioned it for years, and now YouTube videos, blogs, and other social media parrot it even though it has never been reliably attributed. Yue🌙 00:12, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Kim Jong-un which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 17:31, 6 April 2023 (UTC)

Infobox Picture change?

Should Jong-Il's picture in the infobox be changed to the posthumous portrait of him which was released after his death? TheSupremeMoron (talk) 13:02, 19 April 2023 (UTC)

No, per MOS:IMAGEQUALITY. Kim's official posthumous portrait is an idealised, drawn picture of him. The current portrait of him in the infobox is an actual photograph taken of him while he was alive; as such a photo exists, there is no need to use a drawn picture. Yue🌙 21:14, 19 April 2023 (UTC)

Yuri Irsenovich Kim

This the claimed birth name of Kim Jong Il in Russia. Is there any evidence that was his actual birth name? BlueRobot116 (talk) 13:23, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

“ Is there any evidence that was his actual birth name? ”

Well, there's three sources cited for that claim. Maybe you can look at those first and critique them instead of asking a silly question? Yue🌙 23:01, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 February 2024

Replace {{family name hatnote}}, then place with {{family name footnote}} in the lead sentence. 103.119.55.216 (talk) 12:29, 24 February 2024 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit semi-protected}} template. I think it is better to have the visibility at the top of the article. RudolfRed (talk) 02:55, 25 February 2024 (UTC)

Koryo-saram?

Just realized; can he really be considered a Koryo-saram? To my understanding, Koryo-saram aren't just Soviet Koreans (of which there are also Sakhalin Koreans, who are often excluded from the Koryo-saram label), they're Koreans who were subjected to the 1937 nationalities deportations. None of the Kim family was subject to this deportation.

Is there any reliable sources calling him as such? It doesn't appear that there's any on the article itself. I may just remove altogether for now; please revert and discuss if disagree. toobigtokale (talk) 08:16, 2 April 2024 (UTC)